YouTube Goodness

General Discussions, Polls, Lists, Video Clips and Links
Post Reply
AV Forum Member
AV Forum Member
Posts: 9050
Joined: October 25th, 2004
Location: Binghamton, NY

Re: YouTube Goodness

Post by ShyViolet » December 29th, 2019, 1:48 am

Lol. :)



Randall wrote:
December 29th, 2019, 1:26 am
Worst of all was Bruce giving up his lifelong mission after 2 CASES. And then again after the third case! Argh!!!!!


Yeah, so he can go on permanent vacation in Europe, hanging out in locales with nice weather and fashionable cafes. :roll: And letting Alfred senselessly grieve for him even though he’s not really dead, without so much as a letter telling Alfred what really happened. (Good thing they happened to run into each other.)


Also....I could be wrong about this (but I don’t think I am) after Begins, does Bruce ever once refer to his parents in any way? We never even see him visiting their graves or re-living the unfathomable trauma he experienced in flashbacks ever again after the first film.


In Burton’s films Bruce’s parents were a central theme, yes even in Returns, since so much of Bruce’s intermittent sympathy/compassion for the Penguin was because both of them lost their parents as children.
You can’t just have your characters announce how they feel! That makes me feel angry!

User avatar
AV Founder
AV Founder
Posts: 25333
Joined: October 22nd, 2004
Location: London, UK

Re: YouTube Goodness

Post by Ben » December 29th, 2019, 4:31 am

Yes to all of the above. :)

As for "twist" endings, I’m struggling to think of one that has really got me since the end of Fight Club in 1999! Maybe Shutter Island, but certainly the likes of Prestige (as much as I like it as Nolan's best film) and Inception ("an intelligent film for dumb people" is my description of that film, with apologies if you like it, or found it in any way intelligent) set up their twists with huge Bob Clampett signposts!

AV Forum Member
AV Forum Member
Posts: 9050
Joined: October 25th, 2004
Location: Binghamton, NY

Re: YouTube Goodness

Post by ShyViolet » December 29th, 2019, 9:05 am

How do you feel about The Others, Ben? I’ve always felt it was sort of like a version of The Sixth Sense where the twist actually makes sense on an emotional/thematic level rather than simply a “plausible” one (not that either film makes complete sense on that front, but the former achieves this FAR better than the latter).

Honestly, I’ve never understood how Cole could bond with Malcom so deeply when he’s (Cole) absolutely terrified of dead people. I mean, even though I guess Cole realizes Malcom doesn’t know he’s dead, there is just no way Cole could tell Malcom “I see dead people” as though it’s some kind of shameful secret when Cole fully knows THAT MALCOM IS A GHOST TOO. Ugh. If Cole had actually TOLD him that he’s dead, and Malcom accepts this, but still wants to help Cole despite that, there would have been no twist I guess...but at least the film might have been an actual drama and not a pretend one. :roll:

Won’t get too into The Others; all I’m going to say is that the subtle themes/emotional beats actually DO justify the “twist” better than almost any film following it within the next twenty years. In my opinion that’s one of the reasons it’s still terrifying, at least in my opinion. (Because there are actual REASONS why Kidman’s character is an “unreliable” narrator, and not simply convenience as it was with Willis’ Malcom.)
You can’t just have your characters announce how they feel! That makes me feel angry!

User avatar
AV Founder
AV Founder
Posts: 25333
Joined: October 22nd, 2004
Location: London, UK

Re: YouTube Goodness

Post by Ben » December 29th, 2019, 9:41 am

I need to see The Others again, but I am a fan.

The Sixty Sense, not so much, because it only works because it’s a film and uses movie logic. You see, in a movie, when someone says "let's go to Reno!", you don’t get a five-hour road trip during which they stop and eat, use the toilet, or even stay overnight somewhere. You just get a cut to an establishing shot of Reno.

But in TSS, when Malcolm says he’ll see Cole at their next meeting, the next thing we see, for us, is their next meeting. BUT where the film dies in that this is ALSO what Malcolm experiences, because if he doesn’t seem to have that whole life going on between the scenes that we see him in.

So when he goes for the date with his wife, he gets back to find she’s gone to bed and he can’t get into the closet. But he doesn’t go upstairs and ask her WTF is going on, the film just cuts, and so does he, to the next scene. So in Malcolm's life, he doesn’t live those moments that occurs between scenes in a movie.

Obviously TSS only works on a first watch because we then know the twist. But for me it only just about worked on the first watch, because not only did I guess what was going on part-way through (and my wife guessed the moment Malcolm was shot!), but because as soon as it was finished it struck me at how dumb it was that Malcolm didn’t guess what had happened to him, since he didn’t experience anything between the scenes.

"I’ll see you next week", he says to Cole, but then he doesn’t actually live a week, he just turns up for that meeting. And how does he greet the Mom, or anyone else, especially his wife, and not think WTF is going on here? Why is everyone ignoring me? How can I go to a strange kid's wake and no-one look at me or ask who I am?

It only works because Malcolm only exists in movie logic. And that’s not actually a very robust way of structuring a massive twist. Yes, there’s the theory that he's in denial and that Cole is actually the one whose purpose is to help him get to that point where he can accept and realise his situation. But then, structurally, that doesn’t work either because he eventually works it out himself when he wife is asleep, which kind of blows that theory out of the water.

And then kind of proves that TSS is really just another twist that doesn’t actually work. The Others, on the other hand, although in basic terms only just kind of reverses the same concept, doesn’t follow the same logic, because events do continue to occur off camera, though we only see what we need to see. And in this case the film does reward on further viewings, as does Fight Club, because we can see things from the other perspective, knowing what we then know.

:)

AV Forum Member
AV Forum Member
Posts: 9050
Joined: October 25th, 2004
Location: Binghamton, NY

Re: YouTube Goodness

Post by ShyViolet » December 29th, 2019, 10:30 am

“Mr. Kermit...may I suggest we save time and pick up the rest of the Muppets using a montage!” ;).


By the way, Shyamalan owes a GIGANTIC debt to James Newton Howard. In my opinion it was JNS’s delectable scores that truly made Shyamalan’s films. (With a HUGE emphasis on TSS...that ending would not be HALF as scary without the mounting horror of “Malcom is Dead”! :shock:)
You can’t just have your characters announce how they feel! That makes me feel angry!

AV Forum Member
AV Forum Member
Posts: 9050
Joined: October 25th, 2004
Location: Binghamton, NY

Re: YouTube Goodness

Post by ShyViolet » December 29th, 2019, 8:19 pm

Also, just wanted to point out one more thing that bothers me about the praise the Nolan films get: the constant juxtaposition of “realistic” with “dark”. In no way does the so-called realism of these movies reflect dark themes. Or a more serious tone. Bale’s Bats spends a large portion of the trilogy working directly alongside the Gotham Police Force, EVEN LETTING COMMISSIONER GORDON DRIVE THE BATMOBILE (Oops, I meant the “Tumbler” :roll:). This goes directly against Batman’s whole reason for being; he is not some glorified cop but someone who plays by his own rules to do what HE thinks is necessary. THAT’S what dark is, not Bats becoming Bruce Wayne full-time so people can continue to believe in Harvey Dent.

And lastly, what on earth does Batman supposedly being: “the hero Gotham deserves, but not the one it needs right now” even MEAN? Why wouldn’t we need Batman, especially if we actually “deserve” him??? (Oh and Gordon calling Dent “the hero Gotham needed, but not the one it deserved” during his eulogy at City Hall right before said line is not only incredibly confusing but also reflects Nolan’s bland and overwritten script that doesn’t say anything that hasn’t been said before. :?
You can’t just have your characters announce how they feel! That makes me feel angry!

AV Founder
AV Founder
Posts: 7270
Joined: October 23rd, 2004
Location: SaskaTOON, Canada

Re: YouTube Goodness

Post by Randall » December 29th, 2019, 11:51 pm

Like I said, pretentious. Empty blather.

User avatar
AV Founder
AV Founder
Posts: 25333
Joined: October 22nd, 2004
Location: London, UK

Re: YouTube Goodness

Post by Ben » December 30th, 2019, 6:03 am

Gordon driving the Batmobile (yes, that’s what it is) is also ridiculous for having a trained cop get in the car of what remains a vigilante in the eyes of the law, without knowing anything about him or who he really is. For all he knows, Batman could be as dangerous as any of Gotham's "bad guys".

Again...these things are called COMIC books. Yes, they can be "dark" and "realistic", but they can never *be* REAL or taken seriously in a true sense, since most of their basic concepts just don’t and wouldn’t work in a real world. I’d love to see someone go through what Bats does in Nolan's films and last more than five minutes with a real bunch of goons. That cape, for starters...and we all know that Capes Are Bad for superheroes for anything other than simply looking stylish!

AV Forum Member
AV Forum Member
Posts: 5199
Joined: September 27th, 2007

Re: YouTube Goodness

Post by EricJ » December 30th, 2019, 3:33 pm

Ben wrote:
December 30th, 2019, 6:03 am
Again...these things are called COMIC books.
(Um...I remember when Joel Schumacher once said that. ONCE.)

User avatar
AV Founder
AV Founder
Posts: 25333
Joined: October 22nd, 2004
Location: London, UK

Re: YouTube Goodness

Post by Ben » December 30th, 2019, 9:59 pm

End of the day...he was kinda right!

AV Forum Member
AV Forum Member
Posts: 9050
Joined: October 25th, 2004
Location: Binghamton, NY

Re: YouTube Goodness

Post by ShyViolet » December 31st, 2019, 5:14 pm

Yeah...I mean even Schumacker knew enough about Batman mythos to keep the film’s attention squarely on his (Batman’s) origins in Forever (much of the film is actually set in his childhood). Not only that, Schumacker did follow Burton’s “realistic” fantasy/comic-book tone, at least to some extent.

In addition, even Batman and Robin briefly explored Bruce’s ties to Alfred, (once more highlighting his lack of parents) particularly when he was a child. OK, it was mainly just that part with Bruce falling in the hallway and Alfred catching him, but at least Cloony didn’t just turn into a character from some 80s buddy cop show (with Alfred as his crime-solving partner). :roll:

Alfred is his father-figure (but not an adoptive father) and occasional advisor. And he doesn’t work in the Batcave fixing Bruce’s tech stuff or do research for him or give him long lectures about right and wrong. Batman has his own ideas on these issues and he’s not supposed to just always ask Alfred what to do.

Also...why the heck does the Batcave look like a parking garage?? :roll:


EDIT: Actually Bats’ relationship with Commissioner Gordon also echoes buddy cop shows/movies from decades past, since Batman works very closely with Gordon on cases, meeting with him (as well as his subordinates) on a regular basis. In addition, Batman confides with him about his plan of action and vice versa. Really, in Nolan’s universe Batman is not much more than a glorified cop who wears leather and happens to drive a tank.

There’s nothing wrong with enjoying this plot setup, but I think it’s also important to note how far away the Nolan/Bale films have strayed from the comics. :?
You can’t just have your characters announce how they feel! That makes me feel angry!

AV Forum Member
AV Forum Member
Posts: 10012
Joined: September 1st, 2006

Re: YouTube Goodness

Post by Daniel » January 3rd, 2020, 1:39 pm

New Pokémon Go commercial:



Beautiful and heartfelt. Relatable too, though for me I had a Pikachu plush! Seeing the old episode in the background where Ash got Squirtle got me. Great on so many levels. Brilliant song choice. The nostalgia. :cry:

AV Forum Member
AV Forum Member
Posts: 5199
Joined: September 27th, 2007

Re: YouTube Goodness

Post by EricJ » January 3rd, 2020, 7:16 pm

Daniel wrote:
January 3rd, 2020, 1:39 pm
Beautiful and heartfelt. Relatable too, though for me I had a Pikachu plush! Seeing the old episode in the background where Ash got Squirtle got me. Great on so many levels. Brilliant song choice. The nostalgia. :cry:
Still, WHY does Nintendo always keep selling itself to grownup nostalgia?
Was Pokemon Go's image too hurt by Hillary?

Remember the old green-monochrome Gameboy, that was eventually reduced to selling "Play Tetris on your bus commute to work! Great Father's Day present!"
(Yeah, nothing says "hip game system" like watching your ok-boomer dad play it.)

AV Forum Member
AV Forum Member
Posts: 9050
Joined: October 25th, 2004
Location: Binghamton, NY

Re: YouTube Goodness

Post by ShyViolet » January 4th, 2020, 9:34 am

I didn’t really grow up with Pokémon but I DID have a few dolls/toys that were special to me and this vid really pulled on my heartstrings too! :cry: Thanks for posting Dan.

“I’ll see you next week", he says to Cole, but then he doesn’t actually live a week, he just turns up for that meeting. And how does he greet the Mom, or anyone else, especially his wife, and not think WTF is going on here? Why is everyone ignoring me? How can I go to a strange kid's wake and no-one look at me or ask who I am?
Yeah, plus how did he even know about Cole getting in trouble at school? (Or being in the hospital because of what happened at the birthday party...or when he’d be hiding out in the church...:roll:)

And honestly Cole’s teacher should really have been fired for calling an obviously troubled child a “freak” in front of the entire class.
You can’t just have your characters announce how they feel! That makes me feel angry!

AV Forum Member
AV Forum Member
Posts: 1210
Joined: July 9th, 2008
Location: Australia

Re: YouTube Goodness

Post by Bill1978 » January 4th, 2020, 10:00 pm

Daniel wrote:
January 3rd, 2020, 1:39 pm
New Pokémon Go commercial:
Wow that commercial really reminded me of the 'His Dark Materials' Universe. Although I did finally finish catching up on that series this weekend so its really fresh in my mind.

Post Reply