Cinderella: Platinum Edition Discussion

Features, Shorts, Live-Action and Direct-To-Video
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Next year's cinderella DVDs... Not so special, eh?

Post by GeorgeC » March 15th, 2005, 11:23 pm

I just looked at the DVD list at Ultimate Disney that was posted via the link on the front page of this site...

Gosh, a lot of those DVDs look like repacks of material already released on the Treasures sets!

Great news for the mass-market that was put off by the tins, not-so-good news for collectors that wanted more of the films that HAVEN'T been put on the market yet...! :cry:

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Post by Christian » March 16th, 2005, 12:46 am

I'm sure everything we want will eventually get released. And I do believe some of this new stuff has material not on any of the Treasures.

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Post by Ben » March 16th, 2005, 5:13 pm

The DisneyLand discs, yes.

But the "Timeless Tales" only add Ferdinand The Bull and The Pied Piper to titles already released in other titles (stand alones and the Treasures).

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Post by Ben » March 19th, 2005, 4:47 pm

The Cinderella specs are...disappointing. :(

Fullscreen transfer, Mono soundtrack - good.

Deleted scenes, reconstructed deleted songs (all from the LaserDisc boxed set) - expected.

The live action-to-film comparison of the opening sequence sounds interesting (nothing like this on the PACKED LD release), but isn't the featurette on the Nine Old Men from the Pinocchio or Peter Pan internation special edition?

"The Cinderella That Almost Was" doc sounds like it might be good (all that info was presented a still frames in the LD), and the 1922 Cinderella Laugh-O-Gram is an LD carry-over too. Hopefully, the 50 minute LD making of will be there as well, but "Rags To Riches" does not sound like it's it.

And I can even get over the kids features ("House of Royalty", "The Royal Life", the "Dream Is A Wish Your Heart Makes" and princess music videos)...

But...WHAT THE HECK is the ESPN Classic thing in there for?? And a sneak peek at the upcoming Cinderella III??????? III?????

My heart sinks... :( :( :( :( :(

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Post by GeorgeC » March 19th, 2005, 9:52 pm

Wasn't Cinderella filmed in fullscreen (1.33:1) any way?

I think the first Disney film that was widescreen was Lady and the Tramp... that was about 3 years after Cinderella (1950).

To my knowledge the only 2 1950s Disney films that ARE widescreen were Lady and the Tramp and Sleeping Beauty. Sleeping Beauty was the first Disney film made in Cinemascope (~2.35:1) and the last Disney animated film made that way for over 2 decades.

Most Disney films since the 1960s have been filmed 1.66:1...

I hate to say this, but there really isn't much difference between fullscreen and 1.66:1 and 1.85:1... You really see the differences only when the aspect ratio goes 2.1:1 or higher... I prefer original aspect ratio for historical/purist reasons but even I don't think aspect ratio begins to impact much until you get over 2.1:1

A bunch of films are made widescreen for basically no good artistic reason at all... A ton of them get released fullscreen for TV or home video and frankly never really needed to be matted to 1.85:1 for theaters other than to hide boom mikes and lights.

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Post by PatrickvD » March 21st, 2005, 9:24 am

Thank the Lord the dvd cover isn't pink.. as for Cinderella 3... well Lion King, Beauty and the Beast and Aladdin were all released as trilogies. Expect a Cinderella 3, Lady and the Tramp 3, Little Mermaid 3, Jungle Book 3 and 101 Dalmatians 3 so they can shove some trilogy boxes in our faces. ugh, Disney, a big BLUGH. I'll still get Cinderella and pretend all these sequels do not exist.

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Post by Ben » March 21st, 2005, 1:56 pm

GeorgeC wrote:Wasn't Cinderella filmed in fullscreen (1.33:1) anyway?
Yes - that's what I meant - good that they were preserving this ratio and not trying to mess about with it.

Lady And The Tramp was 1955, and was animated in 2.35:1 for an anamorphic CinemaScope print. There was also a little known Academy (1.37:1) version that was sent out to non-CinemaScope theaters (as with the move to Dolby Stereo and the digital revolution now, some theaters were not widescreen capable).

Interestingly, this "fullframe" Lady And The Tramp was a completely reversioned edition of the feature. Like the recent Pixar "re-composing", characters were moved around frame and wider frames often had imaging added to them top and bottom, as well as the usual optical pan-and-scan technique. It was likely Walt was looking forward to when Lady And The Tramp would play on TV (as well as the non-widescreen theaters), but I really hope that both versions will be present on the upcoming DVD, as it really would be a fullframe version worth seeing.

Sleeping Beauty, the Studio's next film, was animated on the same customed drawing boards, but printed to Technirama 70mm film (a non-anamorphic widecsreen process). This yielded better results and was also used for The Black Cauldron (1985). All the Studio's films between 101 Dalmatians (1961) and Fox And The Hound (1981) were animated and shot to a 1.37:1 frame (this includes Mary Poppins, Bedknobs And Broomsticks and Pete's Dragon). The Rescuers is the odd exception, being animated to a true 1.66:1 frame.

All of Disney's post Black Cauldron films have been 1.66:1 framed, apart from the 2.35:1 Atlantis, which was anamophically squeezed to a Panavision release print.

There is a great difference between 1.66:1 and 1.85:1 - just check out the differences between the LaserDisc Beauty And The Beast (at 1.66) and the DVD release (at 1.85)!

Plus, all of Disney's VHS fullscreen transfers come from the 1.66 version, meaning less cropping from the sides (though still losing a quarter of image). Just see how much difference is gained when comparing the top and bottom of the 1.85:1 Lion King LaserDisc (when Simba "grows up" walking along the log in front of the moon) and the VHS: the moon is sliced off top and bottom in the 1.85 theatrical/LD print, whereas we see the whole moon and more in the VHS. The DVD puts things right with a full aperture 1.66 image, which shows both sides, top and bottom.


But, yes, in answer to your question, all Disney films including Cinderella were fullframe, as were its followups Alice In Wonderland (1951) and Peter Pan (1953). After the two 2.35:1 features, the Studio produced 1.37:1 films again, which were framed "open matte" for masking off top and bottom in theaters.

Hope that helps! :)

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Post by ShyViolet » April 7th, 2005, 11:19 am

I am now the proud owner of Mickey Mouse: In Living Color Volume II.
(I want Volume I too but for right now, it's a bit too expensive.)

It rules!!! The only thing I don't like is that STUPID, STUPID Edgar Bergen (is that his name?) narration on Mickey and the Beanstalk rather than Sterling Holloway's version. (The one I grew up with).

Ben, thanks again for your informative review.
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Post by Ben » April 8th, 2005, 9:28 am

I agree.

As I think I say in the review, the Bergen version is already out on disc in the original form of Fun And Fancy Free.

I'd have MUCH preferred one of the self-contained versions of this story, either the Holloway version or the Ludwig Von Drake edition from the 1963 Disney TV show.

Granted the Holloway version wouls have been the best, since this has been unavailable for some time, especially since the clip they use (from F&FF) is essentially the whole second half of the movie, with a simple fade in, meaning that it totally doesn't work as a stand alone segment.

I have the Von Drake version on LaserDisc, but would dearly love to see the Holloway edition again.

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Post by ShyViolet » April 9th, 2005, 7:41 pm

Sterling Holloway is the bomb!!!!!! :)

I think he did: Pooh Bear (SOOOO much better than Jim Cummings :twisted: )

Kaa the Snake

that ranger in the Humphrey Bear cartoons

....and others... :wink:

What I DON'T understand is why they replaced the Holloway version in the first place. The jokes JUST DON'T WORK any other way because (I assume) the film was PRODUCED with Holloway's version in mind to go with the visuals.

I've never even seen the other part of F & FF (I didn't find out about it until I was much older)

It's cool to see Mickey, Donald and Goofy together. They make a great team! :)
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Post by Ben » April 10th, 2005, 10:17 am

Nope.

Fun And Fancy Free IS the original version of this story.

The Holloway version was released later, as a way of re-issuing the segments from Walt's 1940s "Package Features" as separate shorts. There was also a version of The Sorceror's Apprentice that featured Holloway's vocal version of the film.

Ludwig Von Drake was the animated "host" of the Disney TV show in the 60s and where possible they would insert him in, making it a natural for the bridging sequences of Mickey And The Beanstalk.

However, F&FF was the intended and first version of the story, Hollyway's was the re-issue and Von Drake the later TV version, which is the one usually circulated around now.

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Post by PatrickvD » April 10th, 2005, 1:35 pm

I understand their decision to use the original narrated scene from F&FF, but I too prefer Sterling Holloway's version.

the Ludwig von Drake version is on dvd now, featured on some educational disney dvd for kids:

http://www.ultimatedisney.com/dla-micke ... stalk.html

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Post by Wonderlicious » April 24th, 2005, 5:42 am

Ben wrote:
GeorgeC wrote:Wasn't Cinderella filmed in fullscreen (1.33:1) anyway?
Yes - that's what I meant - good that they were preserving this ratio and not trying to mess about with it.

Lady And The Tramp was 1955, and was animated in 2.35:1 for an anamorphic CinemaScope print. There was also a little known Academy (1.37:1) version that was sent out to non-CinemaScope theaters (as with the move to Dolby Stereo and the digital revolution now, some theaters were not widescreen capable).

Interestingly, this "fullframe" Lady And The Tramp was a completely reversioned edition of the feature. Like the recent Pixar "re-composing", characters were moved around frame and wider frames often had imaging added to them top and bottom, as well as the usual optical pan-and-scan technique. It was likely Walt was looking forward to when Lady And The Tramp would play on TV (as well as the non-widescreen theaters), but I really hope that both versions will be present on the upcoming DVD, as it really would be a fullframe version worth seeing.
I once read that the fullframe Lady and the Tramp was actually made as a back-up plan in case Cinemascope hadn't caught on by the film's release. Or am I hearing things? :roll:

Also, will Cinderella include an audio-commentary or something similar? It doesn't say on the specs, but I'm hoping that this will make up the "much much more" section instead of a virtual pumpkin-coach ride.
-Joe

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Post by Ben » April 24th, 2005, 8:47 am

No news on a commentary for Cinderella, but likely it will have something (after all, Canemaker did a good one for Dumbo).


Yeah, that's the same version of Lady And The Tramp I mentioned. As I said, Walt ordered this second, re-framed version for TV "as well as the non-widescreen theaters", which would take into account future showings had widescreen/Scope not taken off.

So you're not hearing things! :)

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Cinderella DVD Website online

Post by JustinWilliams » April 28th, 2005, 4:22 am

Due to go online any hour now is the Cinderella DVD website - I don't know whether it's updated from the preview I saw before which had the trailer on it and nothing else - but it's something to keep an eye on! http://disney.go.com/disneyvideos/anima ... ndex2.html

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