Disney's Raya And The Last Dragon

[ShyViolet]

If "she" cringed in personally-offended horror (as all female viewers judge all film characters solely on the basis on whether they themselves would ever do what the female protagonist does)

Well, I can’t speak for other female viewers, but that’s definitely not how I view a film character, Disney or not. I don’t look at the gender of the fictional person as a defining trait, but at their behavior and actions.

I have related to both male and female characters while watching a myriad of films, animation or not. And I have a strong feeling that there are quite a few other women who have as well.

[Randall]

Anytime the word "all" is used in the context of explaining an entire gender (or any other group of people), well.... that tends to be incorrect. Overgeneralizing does a disservice. I understand - my own brain tries to place individuals into easily-defined boxes at first, but my expectations are constantly and delightfully thwarted by the beautiful diversity of the human race.

And that proposed modern take on Snow White actually sounds perfectly valid to me, Eric, though you seem to be mocking the idea. The so-called "agenda" of presenting a strong, independent, and capable female is not something to be reviled. Walt changed with the times, so I think it's okay if his studio does too.

[EricJ]

And that proposed modern take on Snow White actually sounds perfectly valid to me, Eric, though you seem to be mocking the idea. The so-called "agenda" of presenting a strong, independent, and capable female is not something to be reviled.

And, in fact, we had rather a FLOOD of them, back during the original mania for Tim Burton's Alice, when studios thought the secret was "Dark fangirl fairytales".
Both "Snow White & the Huntsman" and "Mirror, Mirror" (we'll leave off "Huntsman: Winter War") proceeded with the idea that girls wanted the fantasy of running through woods, poison apples, sleeping in glass coffins to be found by princes, and even hanging out with seven adoring platonic fixer-upper comic males, but the "Cleaning house to earn it" idea?...Nnnnot so much.
You can improve a story by giving nameless characters personalities, but if you just want to personally cherrypick the basic moral core of the story without taking it for good and bad...that's hypocrisy.
And you tend to find a lot of it when you pitch projects to one demographic's drooling tastes for money, or think that you're waging the glorious Good Fight by pitching them to your own and nobody else's.

(And anyone who says "What? Girls don't say 'That character was so stupid, I would never do that!'" has only to look at the two dozen or so female First Reaction posters on YouTube, giving their first-impulse reactions to watching MCU, Empire Strikes Back, 00's Disney and 80's horror for the world to see. You can take your pick. )

[Dacey]

I actually tend to find myself relating to female characters more than male ones, for whatever reason.

But this conversation seems to be going nowhere productive. Again.

And to be an echo chamber for Rand, lumping an entire gender and/or group of people into one category (especially in a negative tone) isn’t particularly cool.

[Randall]

(And anyone who says....

No one's saying that NO ONE says that. I'm saying NOT EVERYONE (or every girl) says that. You do tend to generalize. Ya gotta admit.

[Randall]

I actually tend to find myself relating to female characters more than male ones, for whatever reason.

And that's often the case for me, too. (I cannot relate at all to the dumb jock, the bully, the frat boy, the womanizer, etc., etc.) Which just goes to show that not every trait can be branded "male" or "female."

[ShyViolet]

And that proposed modern take on Snow White actually sounds perfectly valid to me, Eric, though you seem to be mocking the idea. The so-called "agenda" of presenting a strong, independent, and capable female is not something to be reviled.

And, in fact, we had rather a FLOOD of them, back during the original mania for Tim Burton's Alice, when studios thought the secret was "Dark fangirl fairytales".
Both "Snow White & the Huntsman" and "Mirror, Mirror" (we'll leave off "Huntsman: Winter War") proceeded with the idea that girls wanted the fantasy of running through woods, poison apples, sleeping in glass coffins to be found by princes, and even hanging out with seven adoring platonic fixer-upper comic males, but the "Cleaning house to earn it" idea?...Nnnnot so much.
You can improve a story by giving nameless characters personalities, but if you just want to personally cherrypick the basic moral core of the story without taking it for good and bad...that's hypocrisy.
And you tend to find a lot of it when you pitch projects to one demographic's drooling tastes for money, or think that you're waging the glorious Good Fight by pitching them to your own and nobody else's.

But how do you know what these woman writers are thinking? Isn’t it just possible that they want to portray strong women as people who happen to be that way; as merely an ASPECT of the story and not the entire story itself?

Oh, and on the hypothetical “female Walt”: why isn’t it likely for a woman to find inspiration from cinema experiences as a young girl, just as Walt did? Also, what about all the classic female writers in the literary canon like Jane Austen, George Eliot, (Marian Evans), and Charlotte and Emily Bronte? They and many others extensively wrote male and female characters from a psychological and humanist perspective and not simply from some arrogant female perspective you seem to think every woman carries.

[Daniel]

Stone silence...

A point I wanted to make earlier to the inane drivel, the female characters that Eric psychoanalyze over are more often than not written by male writers. Gasp! A fact that can't be refuted but as I know all too well be stubbornly ignored and be brought up again and again and again...

[Farerb]

https://twitter.com/getFANDOM/status/13 ... 21632?s=19

[Ben]

When they say "cut" of the movie, this is probably an earlier storyreel version where the artists let their imaginations rip. I doubt it went through animation and rendering to the point where it was submitted and would have got an R without cuts/changes. Now there’s going to be a whole "release the R cut" movement when it doesn’t really exist!

[Daniel]

Not even PG-13, they go straight to R? That's madness.

[Bill1978]

Gee even The Black Cauldron never got the R rating talk.

[EricJ]

When they say "cut" of the movie, this is probably an earlier storyreel version where the artists let their imaginations rip. I doubt it went through animation and rendering to the point where it was submitted and would have got an R without cuts/changes. Now there’s going to be a whole "release the R cut" movement when it doesn’t really exist!

"Because it'll PROVE that animation is not just a medium for children!"
Oh, those old 00's Eisner-vs.-Pixar fan demons die hard. And then, when the Zack Snyder fans try to join for "solidarity"...

And the key takeaway word in the Tweet is "Here's what we WOULD HAVE gotten..."
In grammar, this is Conditional Tense, stating an action that did not happen, but might have under different alternate conditional factors. Like, without studio heads, producers and 2nd-draft rewrites.

[Farerb]

It could be the version that Paul Briggs and Dean Wellins worked on and the reason why they were replaced.

[Farerb]

Trailer: