Animation cell/Production cell the same thing?

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Animation cell/Production cell the same thing?

Post by Baree » December 3rd, 2010, 4:12 am

Ok, since nobody knows the answer to my original question below, here is another one without starting a new thread. You sometimes see production cells and animation cells from cartoons being sold on Ebay. From the looks of it they are the same thing, can anyone confirm this? Also, I always assume that there is only one of every cell (though of course there are a lot of cells with almost similar poses). True?

When I was discussing the Dutch animated movie "Sebastian Star Bear: The First Mission" with someone, this person claimed remembering seeing a weird crossover movie with Sebastian and Griselda from this movie with the Yogi Bear gang. I am sceptical, yet intrigued. Does anybody know anything about this? Person said remembering something with a circus and evil ringmaster, which made me wonder since the Sebastian movie also features a circus (no evil ringmaster though).

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Post by GeorgeC » December 9th, 2010, 11:32 pm

.... I'm really not trying to be a smart aleck but this kind of puzzles me about people sometimes...

You're 26, right?

There's a point in time where you have to do the research for yourself. Why do you have to rely on me or anybody else to find the answers to your questions?

Huge Internet.

Lots of websites that could answer your questions.

Google them!

This is also the wrong forum to ask that question in. It's really not an "Outside the Lines" topic. OTL is more for things that are not necessarily animation-related. The site owners kind of want to keep the animation stuff together in the other forums.

Also, it's "cel," NOT "cell." "C-E-L-L" is the smallest living unit of an organism.

"C-E-L" is shorthand for "acetate cel," the transparent plastic sheets that used to be inked and painted on.
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Re: Animation cell/Production cell the same thing?

Post by Baree » December 10th, 2010, 1:04 pm

Ok, thanks? I did google, but I couldn't find an answer right away, and since I was pressed for time I figured I'd ask here. But fair enough, if this is not a community for questions I will refrain from asking them.

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Post by Randall » December 10th, 2010, 1:46 pm

You can certainly ask a question. George is just being George. ;) Anyhow, he was really just saying that the particular part of the forum you chose was incorrect, since your question IS certainly on-topic. You could have just asked it in another section. No biggie.

A production cel is one actually used in the production of a movie or TV show. An animation cel may be that, but it also could be something just made as a collectible.

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Re: Animation cell/Production cell the same thing?

Post by droosan » December 10th, 2010, 2:26 pm

The distinction of a 'production' cel is generally given to any cel which was actually photographed for use in the film.

There is a subcategory called 'model' cels; these were generally one-off cels created to establish which paint colors were to be used for certain characters in particular 'lighting' conditions. Although they are created for use by the crew .. since they do not appear on-camera, they are usually not referred to as 'production' cels.

Cels created exclusively for sale in animation galleries are generally called 'sericels' (derived from the term serigraph, which is a form of silk-screening); although, sometimes, these are hand-painted by professional cel artists. These cels are often made in 'limited' editions of several hundred examples. They can sometimes fetch high prices .. but 'production' cels are widely considered by collectors to be more valuable/desirable.

----------------------

Yeah, and George_C: Dude. :|

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Re: Animation cell/Production cell the same thing?

Post by Randall » December 10th, 2010, 7:02 pm

droosan wrote:The distinction of a 'production' cel is generally given to any cel which was actually photographed for use in the film.|
Thanks for phrasing that better. :)

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Post by GeorgeC » December 11th, 2010, 2:35 am

Those distinctions between production cel and just plain old animation cel are very important to make.

There are a lot of animation cels sold in galleries and online that are NOT production cels. These are usually what they call sericels; a sericel is a run of cels that are done in batches of at least 100, sometimes 500, or even 1,000 and up to 1,500 copies!

Sericels generally recreate classic scenes in animated features and shorts, or TV series as in the case of sericels created for the old Warner Bros. Studio Stores. Sometimes they're alternative pieces like sericel recreations of character model sheets or scenes specially created to be sold through galleries.

A real production cel is unique. It's one of a kind... not a mass-produced product.

One mistake that shouldn't be made is that only sericel features xeroxed inklines. Disney first used modified Xerox photocopiers for production cels way back during the making of 101 Dalmations. With sericels, the coloring is ALSO screened onto the cel.

There have been artists demonstrating cel painting at Disney theme parks but I doubt all the sericels Disney has manufactured were all hand-painted. For feature films, yes they were hand-painted. Sericels sold in galleries? I doubt it!

Most of us in the forums that are over 30 have some animation production art or pieces created for galleries. I've got production cels and production drawings mainly from Batman: TAS and Superman: TAS. I've also got an original production drawing (animation drawing for basis of a cel) from a 1990s Bugs Bunny short ("Blooper Bunny") and two Disney pieces one of which is a lithograph with reproductions from various Mickey Mouse model sheets. That litho is one of my favorite pieces even though it's one of probably at least 350-500 copies.

My favorite art tends to be the pencil artwork. I'm not as big a fan of cels since they deteriorate over time no matter how well they're displayed or stored. They're also at least two generations removed from the intent/original work of animators. The inklines tend to fall off over time. It's a consequence of using economical Xerox'ing... Hand-inked lines tend to stick to the cel acetate better than machine reproduction.
"Waiter, more champagne...and plenty of ice!"
- Randall/Time Bandits, 14 April 1912, 20 to midnight -- local time

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